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Advice Webley Raider - barrel/breech misalignment ?

Discussion in 'Anything Airgun Related' started by Eh?, Apr 13, 2009.

  1. Eh?

    Eh? Member

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    Location:
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    As per thread title, I have a single shot .22 Webley Raider which appears to have a misaligned barrel in relation to the breech block.

    So far I have tried two different sets of branded scope mounts, three scopes (Simmons, Bushnell and Leopold), and the silencer has been removed for testing and refitted once it became obvious that removing it made absolutely no difference.

    This is what happens:

    Zero to 15 yards (approx) and I can get ragged single hole 5 shot groups. At 30 yards (approx) the gun shoots wide and left.

    Re-zero at 30 yards and I get 5 shot groups coming in at just under an inch, but at 15 yards I shoot wide and right.

    A willing friend has tried the same gun with the same results, so this isn't just me being a gimp :)

    Logic tells me that the barrel must be out of alignment to the breech/loading port area, which would explain why I get the wide/right and wide/left behaviour at different ranges/zero.

    Question is, what the heck do I do about it ?

    This was one of five identical guns all bought at the same time for various customisation projects. It is the last of the five and has long since passed out of warranty, even though it is straight out of the box and has had less than 50 pellets through it.

    As an aside it also seems to 'nip' pellets slightly on loading. The probe does not load cleanly - the pellet stops with about two thirds of the skirt visible and requires a bit of manual jiggery pokery to get past whatever is obstructing it (presumably where the barrel mounts into the breech block).

    I can get my hands on a fibre-optic camera to check the loading port and rectify the snagging pellet problem, but the misalignment is something else entirely.

    Anyone got any suggestions ?

    I'm guessing the only viable solution is to either bin the gun, have a gunsmith repair done, or replace the majority of the gun's major parts.

    It would be a shame to bin it - I really like the old single shot Raider - it's one of the most pointable and idiot proof guns I know of, but if this is likely to be a cost prohibitive refit then I'll cut my losses now and just buy another gun.

    I've steered away from packing the scope mounts on one side purely because:

    A: I don't feel I should have to

    B: I spend quite a bit on my optics and don't really want to risk killing a decent scope when replacing the rifle is cheaper than replacing the glass...

    Thoughts anyone ?
     
  2. Andy

    Andy Administrative Staff Member Founder

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    I would sort out the pellet loading problem first, is the probe pushing the center of the pellet when loading. If something in the barrel is fouling the pellet when loading, then this will no doubt be damaging the pellets. I would shoot the gun low on air and fire some pellets into a bucket of water just so you can see if the pellets are leaving the gun damaged.
     
  3. Eh?

    Eh? Member

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    Location:
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    Thanks, but I've already done that.

    As long as I manually feed the pellets they run through clean and undamaged.

    If I use the probe to load and seat them, they get 'shaved' slightly on one side of the widest part of the head (using standard RWS Superdomes).

    If I use my fingers and 'wiggle' the pellet into position and then seat it with the probe they exit the gun clean.

    I don't actually want to mess around with the breech unless I know I can resolve the misalignment. It's a chunk of work that I can avoid doing unnecessarily if there isn't anything I can do for the gun itself to resolve the barrel/breech misalignment.

    I hope that makes sense...
     
  4. Andy

    Andy Administrative Staff Member Founder

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    If you think the breach is out of alignment then try a new breach, just make sure the barrel is OK first. I here of other users with accuracy problems that they can't seem to cure and they send the gun back to the manufacturer, they come back with a new barrel fitted and all is well.

    PS: don't bin the gun, send it to me. ;)

    Edit: So what happens to the accuracy if you hand load the gun.

    Edit again: make sure your barrel band is not moving.
     
  5. Eh?

    Eh? Member

    Messages:
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    Location:
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    Accuracy remains exactly the same if the gun is hand loaded and goes a little weird if I use the probe on its own without 'wiggling' the pellet into place first. Not good for cold finger days...

    Send the gun to you ?

    We'll see.

    Depends on how much a barrel will be.

    There's a BSA Ultra winking at me as well, which isn't helping...

    ;)

    ---------- Post added at 21:57 ---------- Previous post was at 21:55 ----------

    Never even thought of that.

    I wonder if it either has moved, or if there may be some slight scope for adjustment by using it.

    Hmmmm.......

    Now you've given me something to think about.

    And on a weekday too...
     
  6. Andy

    Andy Administrative Staff Member Founder

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    New barrel from chambers is £51.84

    Breach block says out of stock so no price listed.

    I take it you have tried other pellets. ?
     
  7. Eh?

    Eh? Member

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    Location:
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    Yes, same results with several major brands of .22 pellets (RWS Superdomes, Crossman Premiers, Bisley Superfiled and Magnum, Webley Mosquito etc.,)

    I've ruled out every variable I can think of without taking the barrel off. Not much point in doing so without a replacement to test it with :(

    I think I'll give Webley a shout tomorrow and ask if they will look at it for me. They should be able to give rough estimates based on the information I supply and if the price isn't too outrageous at least the gun should come back with a batting chance of holding zero at more than one range...

    ;)
     
  8. Andy

    Andy Administrative Staff Member Founder

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    There goes my free gun, :( i was even going to let you pay for the postage as I'm such a generous person. ;)
     
  9. Eh?

    Eh? Member

    Messages:
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    Location:
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    Well, if Webley won't entertain it...

    ;)

    Thanks for your input. Will let you know the outcome.

    On the one hand I'd like to see it sorted, because I like these rifles so much, but on the other, it would be the perfect excuse for that BSA...

    :p

    ---------- Post added at 13:53 ---------- Previous post was Yesterday at 22:49 ----------

    Webley won't quote on the work without seeing the gun.

    I described in great detail what the fault was, and even asked for a ball-park based on replacing barrel alone, and also on replacing the entire action, but they won't quote without inspecting the gun.

    I'll try a local gunsmith later this week and if I still get no joy the gun will be scrapped :(
     
    Last edited: Apr 14, 2009

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