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Walther Lgu Port Size

Discussion in 'Technical' started by rusty cogs, Jun 9, 2020.

  1. rusty cogs

    rusty cogs Active Member

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    Hello there,im thinking about taking my lgu to pieces and would like to drill out
    the transfer port.
    could some one please recommend a good diameter ?
    Im not going to alter much else.Its a .177

    thx
     
  2. alan1

    alan1 Engaging Member

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    3mm or 3.2 mm that's what seems to be the norme I did mine to 3.2 mm then had to cut spring down
     
    hmangphilly likes this.
  3. hmangphilly

    hmangphilly Posting Addict

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    Why would you like to drill out the transfer port chum ?

    What's the problem ?
     
  4. gb2017

    gb2017 Busy Member

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    Hi

    The question that seems to govern this is what pellets do you shoot that suits your lgu?

    I had my lgu tuned and at the time the advice given was a 3.6mm tp, this "wisdom" apparently has now changed :facepalm:

    If you use jsb's it is recommended a smaller port is used due to the softness of the lead and the fact that a more compressed puff helps the skirts form to fit the barrel, if you use h&n's and their ilk that have a harder lead alloy / tighter skirts then a wider port is ok as they already are more "fitted" to the barrel and so the puff is to get them going.

    So that's left me with a wide TP and I use JSB's, go figure what my thoughts on it are!!!

    The morale of this story..... I am buggered if I know but it doesn't leave me with a warm and fuzzy feeling about some experts

    PS and what the previous poster says, why do you feel the need? If its listening to others then there's the morale of my story ;)
     
    Gat Man and Radlad like this.
  5. rusty cogs

    rusty cogs Active Member

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    Hi thank you for your replies . I must be honest and state that i have not found the most accurate pellet yet
    i suppose i should really ask questions of myself like "hmangphilly" just has. and then there's the old phrase,
    " if it aint broke, dont fix it ! "
    i just wanted to improve it . im the third owner and i was expecting something special , semi tuned and pleasant
    to shoot,maybe even site picture mantained.when i fire it its one hell of jolt!
    I wanted something a bit special that i would be proud of owning but now i am not sure im going to keep
    it so i dont want to splash out loads on tuning. I just want it to be a bit more pleasant to shoot and feel happier
    to pass on .
    i also thought increasing the tp was a standard thing, i guess it aint
     
  6. cooper_dan

    cooper_dan Busy Member

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    If you are the third owner and it's got a harsh shot cycle, maybe a previous owner has already done some 'tuning'.

    What other springers do you have or can test that you can compare it to? Springers do recoil, even the good ones.

    Maybe strip it down and do some checks. Measure the TP in case it's already been made too large. Chrono the rifle, measure the preload, the measure the spring and work out efficiency. Maybe breech seals or piston seal are leaking and a previous owner has stuffed more preload in to get the power up.
     
    hmangphilly likes this.
  7. gb2017

    gb2017 Busy Member

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    if you are getting a jolt then that is certainly not right, maybe it might just be worthwhile giving it the basic once over, strip clean and relube, might be that you need to "undo" something that has been done

    stick it across a chrono as well and see that there are not any surprises, once you have acquired a bit more understanding then think about how to tune if you still wish to

    have also found fitting a small moderator on these also improved the shot cycle to a nice thud, or at least has with the half dozen I have shot
     
  8. hmangphilly

    hmangphilly Posting Addict

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    Shouldn't be too much of a drama to reduce your TP back down chum .
     
    gb2017 likes this.
  9. gb2017

    gb2017 Busy Member

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    shouldn't be, the question is can I be ar5ed, and tbh the answer is no
     
  10. Joha

    Joha Newbie

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    Had the same and started to read, again

    jotted down the statement below off a post on the BBS some time a go.
    Just wondered if it is correct? as on the odd occasion i have done the opposite to whats suggested & got the required results.

    If power is greater with heavy pellets.
    Then you have:
    • Too much piston weight
    • Too little stroke
    • Too much T/P volume
    • Too much spring
    “This is slammy”

    If power is greater with lighter pellets.
    Then you have:
    • Too little piston weight
    • Too much stroke
    • Too little T/p volume
    • Too little spring
    “This is bouncy”

    By Jon Willingham on FB, previous owner of my Warren Edwards FT LGU stock bought by him in mei 2017


    Pellet moving test.
    Place pellet on top of turret/ mount/ barrel and shoot.
    1. Pellet go's backwards, which clearly shows excessive piston bounce.
    2. Ideally the pellet should slide forwards a little to show correct recoil.
    3. Or even better no movement but I find that only happens when you combine a good tune with a very heavy stock.
    Its a guide as to how well the gun is behaving.

    Tip from NickG
    test with 8.4 and 7.9 pellets you want it to be making a tad more power with the light pellets than the heavier ones to ensure its bouncing a little .

    https://www.airgunforum.co.uk/commu...-jsb-pellet-velocity-test-0-50-metres.174275/

    https://www.airgunforum.co.uk/community/index.php?threads/springer-tuning.237647/page-2

    https://www.airgunforum.co.uk/commu...ctors-that-affect-performance-discuss.143305/

    changeable transfer port spring airgun
    https://www.pressreader.com/uk/airgun-world/20170501/282754881563838

    https://www.pyramydair.com/blog/2016/07/give-me-more-power-2/

    Best hint quote from Biwai
    It's your gun and your tune. find where the magic happens and leave it there.

    Don't blame the springer, it's the idiot who could not resist to butcher the poor thing again .
    20200524_162256.jpg
     
  11. Paul M.

    Paul M. Busy Member

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    Hell of a jolt seems wrong, I can watch pellets bounce off a bell target at 25 yards with mine no problem:(.
     
  12. Nickg

    Nickg Busy Member

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    A standard LGU shouldn't be harsh, far from it . I would give it a service , ie new breech seals , make sure the piston seal is the right one and sealing , then lube it up properly, also check you have the standard spring in it . The enlarged transfer port size idea came from a "certain someone " ( Phil knows who I mean ) who suggested that the small port was causing springs to either break or lose length, when it was probably a bad batch of springs :facepalm:
     
    hmangphilly, gb2017 and Paul M. like this.
  13. hmangphilly

    hmangphilly Posting Addict

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    Op
    Don't get too hung up about super low recoil and being able to see all your pellets in flight .

    Sure. It shouldn't kick like a 12 bore ,but It's a springer .........you're always going to know that you've fired it .

    Check these vids of Steve Privett's to see the sight picture movement of a 2 x springer world ft champ.

    https://shooting-the-breeze.com/search/705/?q=twangcam&o=date

    If you're unsure of your gun and it's cheesing you off ,Pop it apart ,give it a clean out and a lube , measure every thing up while you're in there .

    These are super simple , I'll give you a help if you need
     
    gb2017 likes this.
  14. Mike6J

    Mike6J Engaging Member

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    I have an LGU in .177, it is untouched and as it came from the box.
    I shoot Umarex Mosquito pellets and it will put shot upon shot with very little noise and certainly no slam.

    The Mosquito pellet fits the loading port perfectly with minimal pressure and it does not fall out, but a pellet can be easily removed with a sharp pin if needed.
    I have loaded the H&N Field Target Trophy pellet and found that the head entered easily but the skirt required far more pressure to seat it in the port than the Mosquito.

    Umarex 0,48g (7.40gr) head 4.40 skirt 4.56 (mm diameters)
    H&N FTT 0,56g (8.64gr) head 4.46 skirt 4.58

    These measurements could suggest the loading port may be tapered.
     
  15. hmangphilly

    hmangphilly Posting Addict

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    Just a simple chamfer on the fe I've seen Mate .

    Small differences in pellet size ill feel very different in a lead and bore
     
  16. Nickg

    Nickg Busy Member

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    Lgu 's seem to either have a huge chamfer or nothing on the lead in , I have found the large chamfer to be detrimental.
     
  17. hmangphilly

    hmangphilly Posting Addict

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    Ooh Ooh time for a pic .......gotta love a pic .............

    Pretty sure that's Lgu Leade.
    The leade angle and finish will affect start pressure , which knocks on to transfer ports , which are connected to the knee bone etc etc

    Fri Apr 13 21-43-48.jpg
     
    Last edited: Jun 11, 2020
  18. alan1

    alan1 Engaging Member

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    Any way isn't the small port in this gun due to it been a 6 flb model and just putting a stronger spring in will not make it a 12 flb one efficiently
     
  19. Paul M.

    Paul M. Busy Member

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    I t
    I thought it was the otherway round and a result of the FAC 20J version.

    I think the OPs problem though is that something is wrong with his gun as its not behaving like LGUs normally do rather than a design or tuning issue.
     
  20. rusty cogs

    rusty cogs Active Member

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    Thanks every one im gunna have a good look and take measurements pre load and spring dimensions
    and degrease....lata . Its too nicer day not to be shooting!

    cheers kevin
     

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