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Minimum Distance to Zero Scope

Discussion in 'Anything Airgun Related' started by Scoobyspares, Aug 12, 2014.

  1. Scoobyspares

    Scoobyspares Donator

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    Sorry if this is a daft question, but I'm worried I have gun issues. Or user issues !!

    Ok so my new scope arrived today, as I work from home I can't really nip out to zero it yet, so my only option is the garden, I only have about 10 metres to play with. I zeroed in the cheap under lever one with the 4x32, but the Xocet won't get anywhere near, it's about 6" about the target with the adjuster screwed right down , I have swapped mounts from one to the two piece ones to see if that was the issue but no joy.

    So I'm hoping I'm just to close to the target, I know I need to go out and do it right but the excitement got the better of me and I had to have a go !!
     
  2. simonc_here

    simonc_here Engaging Member

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    Have you tried turning it the other way?
    At that close range your pellet will still be climbing from the barrel so you might find you need to adjust in the other direction.
     
  3. timmytree

    timmytree Top Poster

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    Would you elaborate on that please, I've been shooting for nearly 50 years and never come across a pellet climbing higher than the barrel or needed to adjust in the way you're suggesting.
     
  4. stryder5

    stryder5 Donator

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    The pellet trajectory is an arc that means the pellet climbs as it leaves the barrel, I doubt that many scopes will zero at 10 yds (except cheap low mag one's), so if you want a zero at say 15 yds (secondary zero 35yds for .177) you will have to aim about 2 mildots (say 2")high to hit target at 10yds. This is an approximation based on 10x zoom.

    Hope this helps. Chairgun Pro available on Hawke website will illustrate this better.
     
  5. mattyts

    mattyts Donator

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    All my scopes have been zeroed at 10 yard at one point.
     
  6. timmytree

    timmytree Top Poster

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    Thanks for trying, I use chairgun and BRC, I just haven't yet come across any gun where the projectile climbs, gravity means the projectile starts to drop the instant it leaves the barrel. That's why so many air rifle scopes need shimming at the rear to get the sightline low enough for the scope to be within adjustment range.
    If the op is hitting 6" high at 10 metres then I think there's a serious issue with scope, mounts or barrel.
    The bit I truly didn't understand was the advice to turn the turret the other way, surely down is down and up is up regardless of where the pellet hits?
    Regards
    Tim
     
  7. the dog

    the dog Petrol engines do NOT like diesel

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    The point trying to be made is the line of sight through the scope will cross the pellet trajectory at two points as the scope is sat higher than the barrel. The pellet will initially travel upwards if aiming at a target at distance :rolleyes:, before gravity takes over.
     
  8. Scoobyspares

    Scoobyspares Donator

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    Thanks for all the replies and advise guys :) I kind of understand what your saying dog, Maybe I'm just to close. I removed the Nikko Sterling and fitted my SMK 4x32 on the same mounts and it zero's in perfect, close to the end of the wind down but expected for such close range I guess, the Nikko was still way above my zero spot/marker. I'm wondering is the scope is faulty or I'm just to close.

    Will be Thursday before I can get out and try it in the field.
     
    Last edited: Aug 12, 2014
  9. timmytree

    timmytree Top Poster

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    Ok. I'm being a pedantic old git here! ;)
    The pellet will start to drop immediately it leaves the barrel, it may APPEAR to rise as it crosses the sightline for a first zero and then drops to recross for a second zero. That only happens if the scope is adjusted far enough or shimmed at the rear.
    Either way, the OPs problem appears to be the opposite to what most people experience, suggesting a cause or cure is a tad more difficult without actually seeing the set up.
    It might help if we knew what gun and scope is being used?
    Regards
    Tim
     
  10. mattyts

    mattyts Donator

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    Perhaps this helps a little:

    [​IMG]

    In Airgun ranges and power levels,the two intercepts are usually 15 and 35 yard or something similar.
     
  11. timmytree

    timmytree Top Poster

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    Nice illustration, thanks. ;)
     
  12. Scoobyspares

    Scoobyspares Donator

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    Webley Xocet with Nikko Sterling mount master 3-9 x 40 PX adj with either 1 or 2 piece mounts
     
  13. Garf

    Garf Active Member

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    Ignoring other variables, A round will rise as it leaves the barrel if the rifle is zeroed such that the scope crosshairs are aimed precisely at a target which is horizontally in line, but the scope is actually aligned downwards towards the barrel. In that case, a shooter will aim perfectly horizontally, but the round or pellet in this instance will first rise then fall. That's not the pellet appearing to rise, that's it rising.

    What is a myth is the belief that rounds or pellets assume a parabola, first rising and then falling. Assuming the scope and rifle are perfectly horizontally aligned with each other, then a gyroscopically stabilised projectile will describe a flat line and then curve down as gravity takes effect.

    What happens in reality however, is that as rifles are zeroed scopes and barrels are NOT perfectly aligned, so a pellet fired with the scope perfectly horizontally will indeed rise, and will cross over as gravity takes over, with the two points meeting at the point of zero.
     
  14. cloverleaf

    cloverleaf Honorary Member

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    Sounds like the most likely culprit is a bent barrel / wonky lockup on the Xocet.. when shooting this close the only problem you should have is with the gun shooting low; try rolling the gun onto its side and looking along the action / barrel from the rear - if the barrel is bent or pished with respect to the cylinder you should see it ;)
     
    Last edited: Aug 12, 2014
  15. landymick

    landymick Very Active

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    If your using mount master mounts that came with scope these can in a word be crap,it may be nothing to do with these but i would try them with out the tape on.Just peel it off & give them a go worth a try IMO.
     
  16. timmytree

    timmytree Top Poster

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    Since you've already tried different mounts I would consider trying a different scope as well to see if you get the same effect.
    Check the clamp plates on the mounts are all the correct way round. Check to see if you have a stop pin on the mounts, if so is it protruding and stopping the mounts being pulled horizontal with the rails?
    Check the barrel lockup, put a straight edge across the top of the main body and over the barrel, is the barrel pointing slightly upwards or is it bent? A break barrel that has been fired with the barrel in the down position can often have this problem.
    99% the problem will be amongst that lot. Let us know how you get on.
    Regards
    Tim
     
  17. Scoobyspares

    Scoobyspares Donator

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    Thanks, yeah I just used what they came with, back in the day I used Sportsmatch, not sure what 'the best' are these days. I'll give that a go.
     
  18. mattyts

    mattyts Donator

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    Sportsmatch are still widely used and popular.
     
  19. Scoobyspares

    Scoobyspares Donator

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    Thanks Tim, Yeah I tried another scope and that seems OK, wound very low but zero's in. I'll try all those things and see if I get to the bottom of it, going to send the scope back for another, just in case that's at fault.
     
  20. Scoobyspares

    Scoobyspares Donator

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    Those it is then :) Would you go one or two piece ?
     

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