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Legends P.08 Toggle Stuck & Rebuild

Discussion in 'Replica Airguns' started by J0SH, Jun 11, 2021.

  1. J0SH

    J0SH Member

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    Hi all,

    I recently had an issue were the toggle on my Umarex blowback luger got stuck in the back position, which prevented me from doing a basic field strip.

    I'm not sure, but I don't recall the magazine space being obstructed like it is in the image when the toggle is cocked back.

    Firstly, has anyone had this issue and know how to solve it?

    Secondly, I removed the pivot pin to see if I could fix the jam but to no avail. Further, I wasn't able to see how the spring (below) was positioned before it sprung out, so if anyone knows please help because I cannot find this answer on videos or other forum posts.

    Any help is appreciated.

    DSC_0504.JPG DSC_0505.JPG DSC_0507.JPG
     
  2. Beagle38

    Beagle38 Active Member

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    Hello Josh,

    Just had a look on my P.08 and no, when it is cocked back the unit you can see in yours (blocking the breech area) flips back out the way into the main unit being pulled by the toggle.

    Sorry I can't help with any more than that.:(
     
  3. Andy_J

    Andy_J co2 Replica Airgun collector

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    Have a look at this thread. It might help you. :up:
    https://www.airgunforum.co.uk/commu...ately-need-help-rebuilding-umarex-p38.346004/

    edit my bad........wrong P model....:confused:
     
    Last edited: Jun 12, 2021
  4. Beagle38

    Beagle38 Active Member

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    Andy_J likes this.
  5. J0SH

    J0SH Member

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    Thanks for that, good to know my suspicion was right.

    I think something may be stuck in the back, but that's just a guess.
     
  6. J0SH

    J0SH Member

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  7. zippy1

    zippy1 Donator

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    Even if it's jammed, it should still strip. Make sure the mag is out, as this will stop the upper sliding forward. There is also a fine black stop-bar, operated by the mag button. It is inside the breach on the right side. This stops the toggle in the "UP" position when it is raised. make sure this is down.
     
  8. J0SH

    J0SH Member

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    I don't think it can because the back part of the toggle has a sort of lip clinging the whole slide to the rear unless it is flush with the barrel. I can actually move the slide but only as far as shown here in the first image.

    You can see quite a gap inbetween the slide and the part that I assume cycles the BB rounds.

    upload_2021-6-11_22-7-13.png upload_2021-6-11_22-6-33.png upload_2021-6-11_22-7-36.jpeg upload_2021-6-11_22-8-4.png
     
    zippy1 likes this.
  9. zippy1

    zippy1 Donator

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    Pic 1 shows your gas nozzle is sitting forward. It should all be under the nose of the toggle, held there under spring pressure. Try to gently push it back under (Don't use excessive force! - you'll damage the nozzle.) The toggle needs to be as close to flat (closed) as you can get it, as you rightly point out it will foul the stop on the upper frame.
    I suspect you have BBs floating around in the toggle/ blowback mech. I would suggest a bit of gently rocking of both the nozzle assy & the toggle, to see if you can dislodge the obstructing BBs enough to get the toggle flatter. You'll get away with a slight rise, but not much. Don't forget to have the safety in the off position & the mag out - or it still won't slide off!
     
  10. zippy1

    zippy1 Donator

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    This might help.... Your toggle has the sliding part jammed forward (stuckBBs?) . In your pic you can see the square top (Marked visible in my pic) & the nozzle (marked N). If you can wiggle it so it retracts enough to let the toggle lie flat, you'll be able to strip it.
    Watch out for the arrowed and "!" marked washer. It sits on the pin beside it and forms the axis pin for the rear pivot of the toggle. Once the upper slides off, it WILL make a bid for freedom! It is only held in place by the "ears" on the rear of the lower frame & belongs on the left side.

    P08 toggleI.jpg
     
    TheArmedBear and J0SH like this.
  11. J0SH

    J0SH Member

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    Thanks for that.

    Tried rocking etc. but it will not give way anymore. If it is a BB then it is firmly lodged and annoyingly stubborn.

    Is there any way to dismantle this without the basic strip?
     
    zippy1 likes this.
  12. zippy1

    zippy1 Donator

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    Not really. Did you try putting a finger on the nozzle/square part to hold it steady, then work the Toggle? From your pics, it looks like the toggle isn't fully open. Another Idea is to get a long flat headed screwdriver up the mag' well and see if you can dislodge anything that way. Maybe try the joint between the fixed and sliding parts...?
    It may well be that you've popped the sliding part piston right out of the fixed part tube. If you can manoeuvre it with a screwdriver or small dowel etc via the mag' well - it might just pop back in. Then the toggle should go flat.

    Below is a WE toggle. It is basically the same design, shown in the normal & "Popped " positions.

    IMG_20210612_005130.jpg IMG_20210612_005159.jpg

    See how in the 2nd image, the piston is out of it's sleeve & binding on the rim. You can also see the square top and nozzle are very far forward - like in your photo. If you can get it realigned - it should pop back in enough under it's return spring pressure, to get the toggle down. Also note the guide for the nozzle end. make sure this hasn't jumped it's track.
    The object of the exercise is to get the toggle down far enough to strip the gun. It isn't a fix. The assembly is much easier to work on once you have it stripped. trapped BBs & distorted springs will be easy to spot.
     
    J0SH likes this.
  13. J0SH

    J0SH Member

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    Oh that's interesting. Appreciate all the help!

    Will have a go tonight and let you know.

    By the way, are you familiar with how the pivot spring (3rd image in first post) sits as I cannot work out how exactly it fits in the mechanism?
     
  14. J0SH

    J0SH Member

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    Update!

    Many thanks!

    Removed the grip covers and could see the piston slightly misaligned which some pressure on it fixed. Now the toggle goes flat and I was able to strip it, but there was nothing out of the ordinary!

    Piston must have slipped for some reason. Haven't tested it yet so fingers crossed, but now I'm left with my own mistake of fitting the aforementioned pivot spring yet still can't figure out how exactly it goes. I'm assuming it locks around the bar at the end of the toggle but it seems almost too difficult to insert it like that.

    [​IMG]
     
    zippy1 likes this.
  15. zippy1

    zippy1 Donator

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    Slide out the whole toggle ass'y from the upper frame. Push out the rear pin & washer I showed earlier to separate it from the frame. You can now easily sort out the middle joint spring & pin. the spring has it's own locating hole and guide. It is correct when it looks like the WE one pictured earlier in the thread. It should look bent the wrong way, with the back end kicked up.
    Pay particular attention to the front sliding part and nozzle. It needs to be clean, smooth & undamaged. Ditto for the rubber nub in the back of the barrel where the BB sits. If the nozzle is sticking forward, due to the nozzle stuck in the nub, or dirt on the sliding parts upper square surface etc, then the front will be left behind during recoil, pulling the piston out of the sleeve & jamming the gun. It can also stretch the spring inside the blowback unit too.
    Check there are no BBs inside the blowback unit too - It doesn't look like they can get in , but they deffo can!

    I have 4 of these things, they're a bit temperamental straight out of the box. but I've found that after I've used them a little, when you strip them, you can see what is binding and galling. I polish anything that pivots/slides/ moves, then relube. A dab of molly for the metal to metal, silicone grease for metal to plastic, silicone for seals.
    Don't forget the mag' . A buff of the outside of the mag & the inside of the mag well with the used molly cloth makes mag changes slicker. A little on the mag spring can help with smooth feeding too - Don't go mad here! :rolleyes:
     
    J0SH likes this.
  16. J0SH

    J0SH Member

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    Thanks a bunch for that. I've sat down today and cleaned it, put the spring back etc.

    Think I've found the problem: a piece has snapped off of the piston (see image), so I think that'll be a replacement part needed. Are there any vendors selling these parts to private individuals rather than retailers?

    DSC_0504.JPG
     
  17. TheArmedBear

    TheArmedBear BearCurious!

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    It seems you have arrived at your initial problem.. but I will link you to a similar situation that I found myself in a while back... There was some good advice & a link to a place to get parts...
    KWC & Umarex P08's are the same gun.. just different branding, as far as I know.
    I also bought the legends version.. which now needs some attention!.. they are a bit temperamental!!
    https://www.airgunforum.co.uk/community/index.php?threads/jammed-p08.279858/
     

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