1. The Forum Rules have undergone some minor changes and updates.  Please take the time to read them; it will only take a couple of minutes of your time. By doing so, you lessen the chance of incurring the wrath of the moderation team or making yourself look foolish to other members.

    90% of users posting adverts in the Sales forums need to be reminded to read the rules as their posts are wrong.  This is unnecessarily time-consuming and will no longer happen - if your advert doesn't follow the Sales Rules it will be deleted and you'll have to start all over again.

    To close this box once you've read it (and the Rules), click on the X in the top right-hand corner.

    Thank you.

    AGF Staff



    Dismiss Notice
  2. A reminder of one of the Forum Rules:

    'Behaviour

    Do not make inappropriate or offensive posts - including threats, harassment, swearing, prejudice, defamation, deliberate insults or name-calling, other negative remarks about this forum, its moderators and administrators or your fellow members. Even if this is just your own personal opinion, RESPECT YOUR FELLOW MEMBERS.'

    There have been changes made to our censoring software in an attempt to help with this growing problem.

    Click the X in the top-right-hand corner to dismiss this notice.
    Dismiss Notice
  3. Dear members,

    Our membership (like our country) consists of people from all walks of life; different in far more ways than can be listed here and each with a different view based on their experience of life - regardless of their colour, religion or cultural heritage. Every single person in the UK has been born of mixed race – we are a multi-coloured and multi-cultural country.

    As many of you are aware there are a handful of individuals amongst this membership that persist in making provocative, inflammatory, racist and otherwise offensive comments. This has been happening across the forum to a certain degree but is most especially prevalent in the Adult section.

    The moderation team has tried to stay on top of this, however unfortunately because of the ‘offensive’ nature of much of its content we don’t monitor the Adult section quite as much as perhaps we should. As a result much of this behaviour has gone unnoticed unless it has been reported to us. While the team always intended to take a "light touch" approach to the Adult section it would seem that some people aren’t quite adult enough to be left unmonitored after all.

    This behaviour is, and always has been against Forum Rules as well as the specific stipulations of the Adults forum and it will no longer be tolerated. We feel it's time to draw a line in the sand and as such from this point onward offenders will receive an immediate and permanent ban from the forum.

    In order for us to achieve our goal of restoring the forum to the friendly and tolerant place it once was, we ask that ALL members be mindful of the content they post and help us to stop unacceptable behaviour by using the 'Report' tool at the bottom of any offending post - the results of which can be seen only by Admin/Moderators.

    You should all receive a copy of this message by PM. 

    To close this message box, click on the 'X' in the top-right-hand corner.

    Dismiss Notice
  4. Hotmail block emails from us entering your inbox. Unless you can setup a safe sender you will not get activation emails from the forum. Please use an alternative provider or complain to Hotmail.
    Hotmail addresses include.

    @Hotmail.co.uk @Hotmail.com @outlook.com @Live.com
    Dismiss Notice
  5. Postings on Politics, Religion & Controversial Off-Topic Material

    The majority of users do not want to read about these subjects and people have left the forum as a result of it – this is after all an 'Airgun' Forum. It’s all very well to say they don’t have to read it if they don't want to, but as most of us use the ‘New Posts’ button there is no easy way to avoid it.

    All AGF staff members are in favour of people being able to discuss what they want, but we have to draw the line somewhere if it is upsetting other users. We don’t want to read about these topics either.

    IMPORTANT- The discussion of politics and religion is no longer allowed anywhere on the forum (including the Adult section).  The only exception is if it's airgun related - they must be put in the Airgun Related Politics section..

    We will not tolerate bullying or personal attacks, racism or any other offensive 'isms'. we will remove these topics from the forum, we will not give you an area where you can abuse each other. We will not hesitate to ban offenders.

    To clear this text box, click on the 'X' in the top right-hand corner.

    Dismiss Notice

Is the value of a military medal being devalued by this?

Discussion in 'General chit chat' started by Cam., Sep 20, 2017.

  1. Cam.

    Cam. Registered

    Messages:
    1,720
    Likes Received:
    482
    Location:
    Southport
  2. Nobbi1977

    Nobbi1977 Donator

    Messages:
    580
    Likes Received:
    306
    Location:
    Lincolnshire
    Service personnel get medals for being deployed and for long service if I recall so this would not be devalueing anything.

    I guess it would be a special range to reward good work and skill. Not all medals are for heroism.
     
  3. Cam.

    Cam. Registered

    Messages:
    1,720
    Likes Received:
    482
    Location:
    Southport
    Point taken, thank you!
     
  4. lone wolf

    lone wolf Pro Poster

    Messages:
    7,292
    Likes Received:
    2,523
    Location:
    Bishop Auckland
    Campaign medals and war medals are primarily based on actually being there in theatre for 30days or more usually.

    Regardless of the role you play you will receive the relevant medal based on that.

    I was a sniper in iraq and did close observation in northern and my two medals are no different to the chefs or administration clerks who most likely never even got there rifles out the armoury.

    The drone pilots should be recognised if there in theatre in my opinion with a campaign/war medal .

    On another note, my brother in law served in the royal navy for 12years on the nuclear submarines and would go to sea on operations for 6months at a time and not have any idea where in the world he was due to secrecy. He has no medals nut spent more time on operations than me, there due recognition in my opinion also.

    The pilot of the drone is not a one man band, theres the ground crew and tech crews do they get recognition, thinking on this i stand by the if you werent there you dont get it stance.

    Sitting safe in a ops room somewhere in the uk is not the same as being in theatre where there is a real threat, the drone ground teams in neighbouring countries are closer to danger than the pilot. If thats how there being deployed, like the US drone teams



    .
     
    Last edited: Sep 20, 2017
  5. Oat

    Oat Very Active

    Messages:
    4,786
    Likes Received:
    2,230
    I believe the medal recognises skill and tact as supposed to putting yourself at risk.
    I have huge respect for all our armed forces, from the admin teams and cooks right up to those defusing bombs and those on humanitarian efforts. They all deserve to be recognised :up:
     
  6. Rob-GB

    Rob-GB Posting Addict

    Messages:
    1,035
    Likes Received:
    275
    Location:
    Whitstable
    I think there is a psychological toll on our armed forces whether they are 1000 yards out with a rifle or at 12000 feet in an aircraft or several thousand miles away in a warm office when told to kill other humans.
    They all deserve to be rewarded for doing what must be done to allow others to sleep soundly at night. Team effort should equal team reward and our guys and girls should get better help when demobbed.

    Rob.
     
  7. That hurts

    That hurts Barely Active

    Messages:
    12,239
    Likes Received:
    11,271
    Location:
    Diss
    Different skill set entirely, but equally deserving IMHO to recognise the skill, advanced training and, ultimately, morality of those operating the drones remotely. There can be no denying the contribution this type of weaponry has made with specific intelligence based targeting, rather than the random carpet bombing we have all seen in other conflicts.
     
  8. mikemjm

    mikemjm Donator

    Messages:
    2,019
    Likes Received:
    4
    Location:
    bham
    i don't think your on the right track there, my interpretation is that the proposal for medals recognises the mental anguish and psychological stress that the drone pilots are under. Danger to a persons mental health or well being as opposed to danger to physical well being.

    I would support a such a medal providing it was clearly seperate from the existing gallantry medals which recognise courage in the face of physical danger
     
  9. lone wolf

    lone wolf Pro Poster

    Messages:
    7,292
    Likes Received:
    2,523
    Location:
    Bishop Auckland
    Its a tricky thing to be able to specify what warrants the award of a medal? Like you rightly say skill should be recognised, and importantly the contribution to a campaign/war effort should be recognised.

    For example in the second world war anyone who was serving in the uk on operational bases with out being deployed to the various theatres of war were awarded the 1939-45 star to show this, possibly along with the defence medal and the war medal, for the people who served abroad they got the above three and a star for what ever theatres they served in such as the africa star, Pacific star, france and Germany star.

    Today the forces have a few categories for medals

    War medals, such as the falklands, gulf , iraq

    Then Osm medals (operational service medal) such as Afghanistan, Sierra Leone, D R congo

    This Osm medal took over from the general service medal in recent years.

    The gsm was a standard medal awarded with bars for certain actions/campaigns such as northern Ireland, cyprus, Borneo,Palestine all the way back to the start of the century

    There should be another medal to cater for other active roles in operations for the drone teams, nuclear subs ect.

    I did 6months in the falklands patroling the islands for Argentinean special forces and protecting the islands, got no recognition for this, there was no clasp for the general service medal for serving in the falklands after war, many believe this should have had a campaign clasp

    Theres probaly many cases for medals and clasps to be awarded, most recent one was for the suez canal clasp to added to the GSM.

    A review of the award system is probaly need now with the way things are today, but that will open up many more cases from past conflicts to be assesed and it will cost the MOD money to issue all these new medals.

    .
     
  10. Oat

    Oat Very Active

    Messages:
    4,786
    Likes Received:
    2,230
    Hi.
    Just stating my opinion. Yours, and the opinion of others may be different.
    My missus frequently tells me i'm wrong... :D

    Have a great day
     
  11. lone wolf

    lone wolf Pro Poster

    Messages:
    7,292
    Likes Received:
    2,523
    Location:
    Bishop Auckland
    Gallantry and bravery medals are a completely different kettle of fish, you have to be there in the thick of it so it will never take away from them actions

    Something like a active service medal? That can be awarded in other cases, but here lies the problem, theres so many cases for recognition it would be hard to have individual recognition for certain actions?

    One medal for all would be the only option?

    .
     
  12. mikemjm

    mikemjm Donator

    Messages:
    2,019
    Likes Received:
    4
    Location:
    bham
    i don't think gallantry and bravery medals are a completely different kettle of fish, the officer quoted in the media link believes that consideration should be given to awarding drone pilots medals for moral courage, which although a different type of courage is still courage. Gallantry medals are awarded for courage. I don't think the quoted officer is suggesting that all drone pilots should get a medal, he is suggesting that there are instances where significant acts of moral courage have taken place which deserve recognition but are not catered for under the current medals structure

    campaign medals are recognition of service in an operational theatre that's all. You get them for doing your job in a demanding environment.
     
  13. lone wolf

    lone wolf Pro Poster

    Messages:
    7,292
    Likes Received:
    2,523
    Location:
    Bishop Auckland
    Moral courage?

    Everyone who wears the queens uniform gave moral courage in swearing there oath of allegiance.

    I do think the medal award structure needs looking at

    .
     
  14. mikemjm

    mikemjm Donator

    Messages:
    2,019
    Likes Received:
    4
    Location:
    bham
    Respect to everyone who has/is serving/served but simply serving does not equate to what the Army itself defines as moral courage.
     
  15. lone wolf

    lone wolf Pro Poster

    Messages:
    7,292
    Likes Received:
    2,523
    Location:
    Bishop Auckland
    I see what your saying mate, its certainly not as black and white as we would like

    .
     
  16. dancza

    dancza Donator

    Messages:
    3,781
    Likes Received:
    2,439
    Location:
    Essex.
    Give them their own medals. There's no denying that what they do keeps our soldiers safe and I'd imagine that they're probably highly appreciated by those on the ground. But they definitely shouldn't receive the same medals as those with boots on the ground.
     
  17. oedbachgen

    oedbachgen Top Poster

    Messages:
    12,265
    Likes Received:
    8,207
    Location:
    Rhondda, South Wales
    I have a couple of queens birthday medals, if anyone wants them:D
     
  18. terry1001

    terry1001 Major Poster

    Messages:
    8,502
    Likes Received:
    1,309
    Location:
    Ipswich
    The drone pilots are taking a (very) active part in the ongoing campaign and there seems no reason at all why they should not receive the same campaign medal as other participants. Their job may seem simple and easy enough but it isn't, it's just different.
     
  19. nevadacowboy

    nevadacowboy Posting Addict

    Messages:
    1,177
    Likes Received:
    1,101
    Location:
    Derbyshire
    A campaign medal is exactly what it says on the tin, therefore if someone took part in the campaign for the relevant qualifying period (usually 28 days) they should receive the campaign medal regardless of where they are physically located. Without the rear echelons the front line would not be able to operate.
     
  20. Ray1974

    Ray1974 Engaging Member

    Messages:
    467
    Likes Received:
    193
    Location:
    Holywell
    You can be awarded the QCVS ( Queens commendation for valuable service ) without a medal, in support of operations, its similar to the mentioned in despatches silver oak leaves. Thats also why they started to implement clasps and rosettes on campaign medals way back in the 1700's, You got a Gulf War 1 campaign medal if you were in Cyprus during the conflict...no clasp / rosette though....Same with the South Atlantic medal, you got it if you were serving in Ascension Island, once again, no rosette though, so there are provisions in place for recognition for these service personnel.
     

Share This Page

  1. This site uses cookies to help personalise content, tailor your experience and to keep you logged in if you register.
    By continuing to use this site, you are consenting to our use of cookies.
    Dismiss Notice