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Computing tech. help needed

Discussion in 'General chit chat' started by Deejayuu, Jan 1, 2014.

  1. Deejayuu

    Deejayuu Donator

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    I have files on a dead PC which are now needed. First thought try the IDE HDD on another PC to see if the files can be accessed. So plugged it with ribbon cable into working PC with OS on ATA HDD. Whoopee they are all there
    So now try sending to another IDE on the mid connector of the same ribbon. OUCH. PC won’t boot.

    Disconnect both IDE drives, still no boot, retry a couple of times and it works again.
    Back to step 1 . Either IDE plugged in results in no boot. Disconnect and it’s OK.

    So which bit of fried/wiped fits? Any helpful suggestions greatly appreciated
     
  2. resnikov

    resnikov Busy Member

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  3. terry1001

    terry1001 Major Poster

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    If you can do it the easiest way is to do it with your old drive on a ide to usb adapter although unless it's very old the drives should be SATA.
    If you want to continue with it plugged into your pc then when it starts to boot you should be able to access the bios (by pressing Del or some other key - it will usually tell you) and then find the option for boot sequence where you should have the choice of the 2 different drives. This will allow you to set it to boot from your new drive and the other should be available as a slave.
    There are too many dufferences in bios and operating systems to be able to give a step by step guide.
    An adapter like the one Resnikov has linked to is the simplest way as I said earlier.
     
  4. OzzyJ

    OzzyJ Donator

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    I suspect this is a master slave issue.
    Lets assume the hdd with the os on is the master then when you plug the extra drives into this machine the duff drive is probably set to master and so when the bios looks for a master drive to boot from it sees more than one and tries to boot from the duff one.
    check next to the the ide connector on the back off the hdd and see if there is a set of pins labeled m/s/cs (master, slave and cable select). There should also be a little tiny connector joining the two pins labelled master. Pull it off and then plug it onto the slave pins.
    this might help. If not then you need to go into bios whilst the computer first gets turned on and select the hdd to boot from.
    hope some of this helps. If not then very big usb sticks are quite cheap now and if only the duff drive is connected to the second ide and set to slave it might be possible to copy from hdd to usb.
    atb
    oz
     
  5. Deejayuu

    Deejayuu Donator

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    Thanks everyone. As I understand it the SATA being on a separate data cable should not be affected by master/slave issues and there was no problem first time . Just not repeatable after my dumb attempt to connect two at the same time???
     
  6. Dan77k

    Dan77k Donator

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    Been a while since I've done this but I believe you should try connecting them using two separate ribbon cables. One will then be the primary, and the other should be plugged into the secondary hdd controller.

    I think the problem is you are using one ribbon which goes into the primary hdd controller, so you will need to change the jumper pins on one of the disks to get the master/slave configuration if attaching both disks to that one ribbon cable.

    Dan
     
  7. Deejayuu

    Deejayuu Donator

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    Thanks Dan, but I'm missing a trick 'cos going back to one on the ribbon stops the boot up at a black screen with a flashing dash/cursor at top left corner. All will be revealed tomorrow when i can get at caddies etc.
     
  8. SteveO

    SteveO Top Poster

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    Remember the master always plugs in on the end of the ribbon too and not somewhere in the middle.
     
  9. 177

    177 Donator

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    I always do data recovery from a low level boot disk, either USB stick or CD. This presents next to no risk to the source drive and

    Provided the PC can see the drive(s) at BIOS level you're good to go.

    Typically I would put the source drive into the PC, unplug your current 'live' drive, and plug an external USB drive in or write the recovered data across the network to an SMB share or to a cloud/FTP service or to CD or DVD.

    Most data recovery disks will be Linux based so network shares will typically be accessed smb://name-of-server/name-of-shared-directory/ as opposed to the UNC path which would be \\name-of-server\name-of-shared-directory

    You can also use a simple command prompt from a bootable Windows CD.

    Assuming the drive(s) are detected by BIOS the rest is just a series of steps to go through. You don't say whether this is the case, or not.
     
  10. OzzyJ

    OzzyJ Donator

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    Along these lines could you just use a live distro running from the dvd and use this to give you a gui to do simple drag and drop file transfer?
     
  11. 177

    177 Donator

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    It's possible, but some distros don't cleanly mount NTFS volumes and may require a little jiggery pokery to get the job done, which is why I didn't mention it.

    Some do, some don't, but a live distro is effectively what some of the forensic data recovery applications are - they're just heavily tweaked for data recovery rather than being a desktop user's environment.

    To be honest I prefer lower level recovery methods - often I use Ubuntu Rescue Remix to carve out the file(s) and/or directory(ies) of interest into a holding location and then cherry pick them out of there. It's all about damage limitation and mitigating the risk to source data, and the drive(s) the data lives on.

    I have a very healthy paranoia regarding data recovery so I tend to go waaaaaaaaaayyyyyyyyyyyy off reservation with my methods. I learned a long time ago what it means to a business to lose not only the data but the hardware it was stored on (motherboard blew and spiked the data drive) and it's not fun when you have nowhere to go other than commercial recovery, which is costly and not guaranteed to recover all or even some of the lost information.

    If the files in question are 'shrug of the shoulders and live without them' that's one thing, but if you really need the data then low level makes a lot more sense rather than simply slaving the drive and booting into your normal Windows desktop with a view of copying information across.

    One vital point that many people overlook is when they put a second drive in with an operating system as well as data on it. Sometimes, depending on BIOS settings, your PC can end up trying to boot into a drive that was never configured for the hardware it is currently in which, again, is why I tend to stay low level.

    So, yes, a live distro can be used, but not all of them can do it easily. I usually keep a Linux Mint bootable USB stick in my laptop bag if I want to boot into a desktop environment - by using an 8GB memory stick there's plenty of slack space on the bootable drive to write recovered data to...

    Whatever works is good :)
     
  12. ambriel

    ambriel Engaging Member

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    My money is on the master/slave jumper settings, too. Remember that your CD/DVD drive is also an IDE device so if you've got another IDE hard drive and the CD/DVD on the same cable you'll need to connect the drive you want to get the files from to a separate cable attached to the secondary IDE controller (assuming your PC has one) because you can only have two IDE devices on the same controller.

    Unless the cable has a section of the wires crossed over (for CS) it doesn't matter where on the cable each drive is connected.
     
  13. radar100

    radar100 Well-Known Member

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    You may also have to set the drive priority in the BIOS. The jumpers could be correct on the IDE drives, but if the BIOS is looking at the "falied" ide drive as the first boot option instead of the current sata drive the system won't boot.

    Get into the BIOS (f2 or del for most systems f12 for some Dell's, esc for others, it should tell you at the first boot screen)
    Look for boot order, most BIOS's have the added function to set which drive to boot from first in a selection. choose the correct drive and you should be away.

    A heads up though, I had an old IDE drive that i connected to get some data from and it took about 15 minutes for the system to boot. may be worth giving it that long to see if it does eventually start.

    Hope this helps
    Radar
     
  14. Deejayuu

    Deejayuu Donator

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    Well on the bright side the files are safe and copied to an external HDD via another PC. to be honest that wasn't the real niggle.
    Still niggles as to where I went wrong first time.

    Will try again with redundant drives/files now the pressure is off. "can't leave b###er all alone" rings loud in the ears.


    many thanks for the help as usual
     

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