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Collectable Pellets Boxs And Tins

Discussion in 'Vintage collectable airguns' started by whitevanman574, Sep 11, 2019.

  1. whitevanman574

    whitevanman574 Donator

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    pellets.jpg i was thinking can anyone print pellets on cardboard ??? and copy them >???

    anyway via this good forums member he sent me this to pop up to torment you collectors :-}
     
    Last edited by a moderator: Sep 11, 2019
    talent, rabbitwrecker, Shoto1 and 3 others like this.
  2. Troubledshooter

    Troubledshooter Active Member

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    Interesting collection of pellet and slug boxes, but one box missing is the Webley .25 pellet box, the only Webley box and label I have reproduced. There are only a few in existence and are easy to detect, as the box is fabricated from cereal box cardboard with remnants of the original printing on the inner surface.
    Any box can be reproduced if you have an original, and the time and patience to dissect it, along with suitable materials to fabricate it, but it's not worth the time and effort in many cases, as pellet boxes often appear for sale on Ebay and particularly at arms fairs such as Binners Kempton Cornucopia of all things Airgun and Military.
     
  3. pjbingham

    pjbingham Prime Kentish Beef

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    Wow! I’d love to own even a quarter of those :cool:
     
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  4. norman

    norman Donator

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    Hi David,

    We must not forget the Melbourne Airgun Fayre too....I saw the very box (.25) you mention there once..:finger:
     
  5. NorfolkDave

    NorfolkDave Donator

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    I came across a whole tray of collectable pellets boxes in an antiques shop. Nearly got suckered as I knew they were way too cheap.

    They were repros.

    Dave
     
  6. norman

    norman Donator

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    There's some clever begger's about...how did you tell they were repro's Dave..?
     
  7. NorfolkDave

    NorfolkDave Donator

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    Just being around antiques since I was a boy. You get a feel for some things. That and the dealer was being very evasive.

    Dave
     
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  8. norman

    norman Donator

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    I find it quite difficult...what do you think of the repro box's on Protek's site..?
     
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  9. NorfolkDave

    NorfolkDave Donator

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    They're well made. Quite pricey, wouldn't fool many collectors. I've got a few that I acquired as a job lot, they are very close. Had me for a while.

    Dave
     
  10. norman

    norman Donator

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    The reason I ask is...

    There are some 1950/60's box's out there...nearly 70 years old...that are mint...I know because I have some.I know the history/provenance of them...so if I offered you some would you think they were copies because they were too"fresh"..:shrug:
     
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  11. whitevanman574

    whitevanman574 Donator

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    Look good next to bsa.s collection copy or not ...i wouldnt care if its just for me on display
     
  12. NorfolkDave

    NorfolkDave Donator

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    A hypothetical question, gets a hypothetical answer. Not necessarily.

    Dave
     
  13. norman

    norman Donator

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    So for airgun memorabilia collectors looking for old pellet box's but without your experience (being around antiques since you were a boy) can you advise us what we should be looking for to stop us paying our hard earned dosh on reproduction box's....:shrug:.....:up:
     
  14. NorfolkDave

    NorfolkDave Donator

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    These aren't great pictures norm, but I've been collecting quack medicine packaging and contents for nearly twenty years. Can you smell a rat in these two shots, there is one.

    Old medicine boxes, tins, packets https://imgur.com/gallery/ww64dNc

    Generally, if something is way cheaper than it should be, that's a start. With the availability of the internet, there's no such thing as ignorance these days. Although, I know a dealer who bought a vase for a fiver at a boot sale and went on to sell it auction for a couple of grand this year, so there aren't any rules.

    The big give away though is going to be the printing. Virtually everything that has been printed at home will not be solid colours like litho printing of old. A glass or loupe will help.

    Paper that has been printed recently will be different, old labels will be on very thin paper if stuck on rather than printed directly. Old paper very often has course fibres within it, these are often a different colour to the base paper. The paper will have aged as well. In a former career, I bought and sold Norwich school watercolour paintings as a sideline. I could often find a bad un from the type of paper.

    Repros will often be from scanned originals, the scanner picks up everything and unless the reproducer is extremely good at post processing it all comes out in the print. Finger marks, glue smudges, dirt etc. Again a glass is your friend.

    Grey card stock is different now, a lot of fakes will be home made in small quantities so they will be made from what's available.

    Glue ages, very hard to replicate that. Not impossible though. But not really applicable for the sums involved.

    And then we have touch and smell. If something feels like it hasn't been softened by age, it probably hasn't.

    Like I said, there's nothing really definitive, I don't specifically collect pellets or their packaging, I have a few. I have been caught out though. Always though when I think I'm onto too good a deal.

    Then as you mentioned, there's provenance.
    There are people in our world, I would buy off unseen without a care. Then there are those I wouldn't.

    Now look at this one.

    Box's indigestion pills https://imgur.com/gallery/wKbaI0E

    Over a hundred years old, completely intact with its contents. The inner tub has been protected by the outer box, so yes I know mint examples can exist. I paid twenty quid for this, expensive for a tub of rennies, but chicken feed compared to Pellet boxes.

    Dave
     
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  15. norman

    norman Donator

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    Interesting....we have a fair bit of old packaging (including myself :rolleyes:) here at our house too as my wife collects old kitchenware/packaging...I guess the reasons why people pay so much money for old pellet tin's/box's is that they were just "container's" for the product (pellets) that you wanted to use..the packaging got thrown away or used as target practice.!!

    A couple of years ago I walked into the local hardware shop (closed now) just down from Melbourne British Legion where the Belltarget club shoot & we hold airgun Fayre's twice a year...there is a gun shop the other end of town...the shop was built from tin sheets & the inside was like that sketch from the two Ronnies (fork handles)...the guy was very much old school too...I asked if he had any pellets I could buy..he said you mean "slugs"...I said yes & he disappeared to the back of the shop.He came back with a couple of pristine box's of pellets from the 1960's..he said he hasn't sold any "slug's" since that new gun shop opened 30 years ago..:eek:

    I asked if I could purchase any more ...he said yes how many do you want?To cut a long story short I bought them all...they had been stood on his shelves for nearly 50+ years (family business) so these things do survive & in "as new" condition.

    I couldn't spot the "rat" in your picture...difficult to tell without seeing it in the flesh & handling them as you say.:up:
     
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  16. NorfolkDave

    NorfolkDave Donator

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    Yep, you got very lucky.

    The rat is the packaged bottle of sloans. Remember a few years ago, all the young bucks were sporting highly groomed taches? The guy on the sloans advert had a superb example, suddenly they were turning up at every antiques fair going. Happily for me, I have a real one. Bottle that is, I know women that can grow better moustaches than myself.

    Dave
     
  17. norman

    norman Donator

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    :D:D:D

    I've had mine since I was 14....:)

    I'm bringing it with me to Norfolk...so you will know me when I drop in on the Belltarget club..:thumb:
     
  18. Troubledshooter

    Troubledshooter Active Member

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    They are so well made that one of them did initially fool a long time collector, until he examined it more closely. If you put two similar boxes next to each other you can soon tell they are fakes as the dirt and oil marks will be identical on both.
    I started to make repro pistol boxes for my own unboxed pistols prior to the Protek versions, and made some at the request of other collectors, but all mine had distinctive differences in the make up and coverings of the boxes, I used black paper on the majority, and there were subtle differences to the labels, but as soon as the repro versions Protek now sells started appearing at Bisley and other fairs, nobody wanted mine any more, so make what you will of that. They've queered the market for many future Webley Air Pistol collectors.
    The Webley .25 pellet box labels as well as the Webley Valvespout oil can labels, which I also reproduced in smaller size to the original, have distinctive differences, in that the apostrophes before and after the name Webley are in what I call the 99-99 configuration, whereas the originals are in the 66-99 configuration. It really is a question of buyer beware where collectables are concerned.
     
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  19. norman

    norman Donator

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    Thanks David,

    It will be interesting in years to come when seller's of "boxed" examples of Webley pistols describe their sales as original...box's included...some might know/realize they are duplicates/copies but other's new to the scene wouldn't have a clue..:(
     
  20. Troubledshooter

    Troubledshooter Active Member

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    :(
    Therein lies the problem :(
     
    norman likes this.

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